Call your congressmen...

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Call your congressmen...

Post by LightWolf » Fri Jan 19, 2018 8:52 pm

...because Democrats have just been revealed to have been spying on Trump during his campaign.

http://video.foxnews.com/v/571545454700 ... show-clips

There is a document that is marked top secret. Tell your local congressmen to release it to the public.

Sorry Dems, you can't get away with everything.

Edit: You want the "Donald Trump, Jr.: Reports about FISA abuses 'troubling'" video, it mentions this document.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by vision » Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:06 pm

LightWolf wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 8:52 pm
It was on Fox;
LOL
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Vander » Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:31 am

Don't Republican's already have the power to declassify the information? The President single-handedly can declassify anything he wishes. Republicans control the committees that can also declassify the information.

I wonder why they wouldn't just release it instead of promulgating innuendo.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Tunnelcat » Sat Jan 20, 2018 3:36 pm

Well, if this FISA memo is so revealing, and I'm not discounting it outright, why doesn't a Republican release it to the public? Dianne Feinstein released the transcript of that private testimony the CEO of Fusion GPS gave to the Intelligence Committee, against Grassley's wishes I might add. So perhaps this guy should do some rabble rousing if he feels so strongly about it, since he's out warning all of us in the public, but doing it in only conservative outlets . Inquiring minds want to know. :wink:

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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by callmeslick » Tue Jan 23, 2018 8:46 am

it won't be released because it IS a FISA order related item, supposed to be top secret. For a FISA judge to grant eavesdropping permission, what OUGHT to be disturbing the original
poster is exactly what the ★■◆● the Trump campaign was into that warranted it being granted. Remember, this is not, ever, a politically driven venue. To suggest otherwise, sans proof, would merely be another signpost of a board member accepting fascism. That is how fascists seek power: denigrate the press, denigrate the institutions of justice, denigrate even law enforcement officials whose integrity messes with the plan. Facism should be fought by everyone, this should not be a party-line issue.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Tunnelcat » Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:29 pm

I thought the same thing, that Trump's campaign was doing some sort of communication with a foreign government during the campaign and that caught the attention of the FBI. So of course they're going to do some further sniffing. That's why they got the FISA warrant. Remember, any form of contact between Americans and other foreign governments, especially a hostile state like Russia, get automatically swept up thanks to FISA, a nice little Bush product that was passed after 9/11. I love it when Republicans create these things, like FISA, that then come back to haunt them. Also, Republicans are so focused the The Dossier, they've totally ignored the fact that Trump and his campaign were already on the FBI's radar BEFORE they got wind of the Dossier, all because of the big mouth of one of Trump's campaign cronies, George Papadapoulos, bragging to the Aussies. Loose lips sinks ships. :P

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/pl ... 18bbed4e19

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/n ... me-w515654

There might be an approved way to release this memo to the public after all.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/01/20/politics ... index.html
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Vander » Tue Jan 23, 2018 3:02 pm

This memo was written by Nunes. After all his nonsensical complaining about unmasking, what makes anyone think the memo is anything more than a red herring written by a political hack?
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Tunnelcat » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:11 pm

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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by callmeslick » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:30 pm

Vander wrote:
Tue Jan 23, 2018 3:02 pm
This memo was written by Nunes. After all his nonsensical complaining about unmasking, what makes anyone think the memo is anything more than a red herring written by a political hack?
investigative reporting showed that the online push to release this opinion piece by Nunes is centered in RUSSIA. Why?
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Vander » Wed Jan 24, 2018 4:53 pm

Because Russia is seeking maximum disarray in the US? Seems like the simplest answer.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Tunnelcat » Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:40 pm

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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Tunnelcat » Tue Jan 30, 2018 5:23 pm

Ooooh! The Nunes MEMO was going to be released today, but Trump suddenly stepped in and stopped it, at least until AFTER his big State of the Union speech tonight. Hmmm, he claims he wanted to check it first for national security reasons. Suuuuure. But I'm guessing the real reason is that he didn't want his big jackoff of a speech being upstaged by the inevitable media storm over the contents of Devin Nunes' cherry-picked memo, a memo he wouldn't even let the Justice Department or the FBI see first. Nunes is also conveniently refusing to let the Dems release their own counter-memo at the same time. What a hack.

https://www.alternet.org/news-amp-polit ... nunes-memo
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by woodchip » Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:08 pm

While you lefties are hell bent on minimizing the memo and it is amazing how you are wearing blinders over the issue of American intelligence agencies under the Obama admin. Let me redirect you all to a similar case way back when. That would be the Pentagon Papers and Excepting the political parties handling it were reversed, the rhetoric surrounding it is eerily similar. I suggest one waits until the memo is released before making totally ignorant comments based on liberal talking points.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by woodchip » Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:10 pm

vision wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:06 pm
LightWolf wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 8:52 pm
It was on Fox;
LOL
Lol indeed. You expect any accurate info from say CNN or MSNBC? Now there are some real Lol news sources.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by woodchip » Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:13 pm

Vander wrote:
Tue Jan 23, 2018 3:02 pm
This memo was written by Nunes. After all his nonsensical complaining about unmasking, what makes anyone think the memo is anything more than a red herring written by a political hack?
Why not wait until it is released and judge for yourself if it is a red herring. From all the fear mongering by the left over this I suspect there is a interesting read coming out tomorrow .
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by woodchip » Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:16 pm

callmeslick wrote:
Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:30 pm
Vander wrote:
Tue Jan 23, 2018 3:02 pm
This memo was written by Nunes. After all his nonsensical complaining about unmasking, what makes anyone think the memo is anything more than a red herring written by a political hack?
investigative reporting showed that the online push to release this opinion piece by Nunes is centered in RUSSIA. Why?
Is the term "opinion piece" the term listed in the talking points you receive? Could it actually be fact based and if it is I suspect you will still present a hugely slanted "opinion" that the facts are other than reality.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by callmeslick » Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:41 pm

there is zero provable fact there, and they left out the data that fleshes out the reality. Stuff like how Carter Page has been under FISA approved surveillance for years, after he made contacts with two Russian agents who were later convicted in Federal Court of espionage. All that really happened, despite Nunes TRYING IN VAIN to point in other directions, was that when the renewal came up for Page this time, he'd been added to a campaign organization that had already been drawing multiple red flags, from dossiers(two of them, it has been revealed), and two foreign intel agencies(which is part of what can't be revealed for security reasons and Nunes knows it). No, Woody, Nunes and a few others have now veered into absolute treason by attempting to undermine the security and law enforcement of the nation. All this memo will do is hasten the rebuttals by those agencies PRIOR to Mueller dropping a very big hammer, as opposed to the other way around.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Tunnelcat » Fri Feb 02, 2018 1:19 pm

A very good summary of the "Nunes Memo", which was by the way, written by his STAFF, in probable consultation with the White House, long after Nunes had recused himself from leading the Russia investigation while he was part of the Intelligence Committee. In other words, he went rogue because he wanted to defend Trump once he saw where the evidence was leading, guilty as hell, then dragged all his Republican sycophants along for the ride. He's now cherry picking that evidence just to support his "opinion" that the FBI is partisan and is just out to get Trump. No matter that the release of this memo is opposed by the current FBI Director, Christopher Wray, a man who was hand picked by Trump himself and Trump's own advisors. So all these Trumptards would rather defend a traitor of a president instead of protecting the interests of our national security. All hail the U.S. of Trump, where our security and law enforcement services will no longer trust the President or Congress to properly handle classified information. So you think there's no accountability now, it just got worse.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... ained.html

And apparently, Sean Hannity is a better mentor for Trump than his own White House advisors, the DOJ and the FBI, people who actually have our national security interests in mind. Good God.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/sean-hann ... rse-he-has
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Vander » Fri Feb 02, 2018 1:58 pm

woodchip wrote:While you lefties are hell bent on minimizing the memo and it is amazing how you are wearing blinders over the issue of American intelligence agencies under the Obama admin. Let me redirect you all to a similar case way back when. That would be the Pentagon Papers and Excepting the political parties handling it were reversed, the rhetoric surrounding it is eerily similar. I suggest one waits until the memo is released before making totally ignorant comments based on liberal talking points.
woodchip wrote:
Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:13 pm
Vander wrote:
Tue Jan 23, 2018 3:02 pm
This memo was written by Nunes. After all his nonsensical complaining about unmasking, what makes anyone think the memo is anything more than a red herring written by a political hack?
Why not wait until it is released and judge for yourself if it is a red herring. From all the fear mongering by the left over this I suspect there is a interesting read coming out tomorrow .
Because the entire show is so badly choreographed that I can't suspend disbelief to enjoy the Kabuki. It's Fonzi Jumping the Shark. As someone that does value secrets being unearthed, at no point would I consider what we're about to see an honest attempt to examine government surveillance.

Believe it or not, I've come into this after months of actively avoiding the news. It was simply having a negative impact on my mental health.

My very first impression on seeing a blurb about Republicans saying "release the memo," before I even knew anything about it, was that it was a manufactured controversy. Why? because I saw Republicans crying "release the memo" as if they were powerless to do anything and didn't completely control every single method of actually declassifying it. At that time, I figured it was bullsh!t and they were just playing up innuendo.

Then, I find out that it's something Nunes cooked up. The guy that was fed info by the White House about the unmasking of names in intelligence reports by Obama officials, and then dutifully and publicly turned around and alerted the White House that he'd been told. And what he put forth, on greater inspection, turned out to be a bullsh!t narrative.

I didn't need anyone to provide me talking points that suggest this whole enterprise is likely just manufactured spectacle with a bullshit narrative that will do more harm than good to honest discourse over government surveillance. I came to that conclusion on my own. It's not like I don't want to have more information available for a discourse on government surveillance oversight and overreach. It has to be honest, though, and I don't think that's what we're about to see.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Tunnelcat » Fri Feb 02, 2018 4:46 pm

Here's the memo in all it's cherry-picked glory. Haven't had time to go through it yet however. Oh, and Trump refused to release it personally. He left the decision to Congress, which then released it. Chicken.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... 7bed8e89c8

http://www.businessinsider.com/how-to-r ... ext-2018-2
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by woodchip » Sat Feb 03, 2018 10:23 am

callmeslick wrote:
Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:41 pm
there is zero provable fact there, and they left out the data that fleshes out the reality. Stuff like how Carter Page has been under FISA approved surveillance for years, after he made contacts with two Russian agents who were later convicted in Federal Court of espionage. All that really happened, despite Nunes TRYING IN VAIN to point in other directions, was that when the renewal came up for Page this time, he'd been added to a campaign organization that had already been drawing multiple red flags, from dossiers(two of them, it has been revealed), and two foreign intel agencies(which is part of what can't be revealed for security reasons and Nunes knows it). No, Woody, Nunes and a few others have now veered into absolute treason by attempting to undermine the security and law enforcement of the nation. All this memo will do is hasten the rebuttals by those agencies PRIOR to Mueller dropping a very big hammer, as opposed to the other way around.
If all you say is true then why are not the Dems disputing the memo point by point? So far no one is disputing anything. Such as:
The Steele dossier formed an essential part of the initial and all three renewal FISA applications against Carter Page.
After a year of investigating the FBI has yet to show the Steele/Fusion GPS dossier was anything but opposition research on the part of the Hillary campaign and thus was a made up vehicle to discredit a political opponent. So in short a made up document was used to obtain a FISA court order to spy on Trump in order to win a election. Tell me, how much more third world banana republic do you want us to turn into?
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Top Gun » Sat Feb 03, 2018 10:58 am

Tell us, woody, just how many times were you dropped on your head as a child?
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by callmeslick » Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:16 pm

what, Woody, did you make that goofy declaration in the first 30 seconds it was released? As the day wore on, the 'memo' was exposed as 1)shoddy, 2) painting a completely false view of available information, 3) likely the handiwork of the White House staff(no member of House committee admitted to any knowledge of the preparation). John McCain flat out declared it to be doing Putin's work. On and on, it has been steadily exposed as an act of Sedition if not outright Treason.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by callmeslick » Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:20 pm

tell us, for instance, Woody--How did we get to the THIRD renewal of a FISA warrant targetting Carter Page in 2016, if the whole thing flowed from the Steele dossier, which the FBI didn't have available until Summer of 2016? How come there is a SECOND dossier, overlapping many of the same claims? How come no mention in the memo of FOREIGN INTELLIGENCE that the FBI has been working on since early 2016, indicating disturbing links with Trumps Campaign and Russians?? Maybe it WAS being dropped on your head, but I suspect you of simply lying to us here like you've done so provably often in the past.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Vander » Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:55 pm

woodchip wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 10:23 am
If all you say is true then why are not the Dems disputing the memo point by point? So far no one is disputing anything. Such as:
The Steele dossier formed an essential part of the initial and all three renewal FISA applications against Carter Page.
After a year of investigating the FBI has yet to show the Steele/Fusion GPS dossier was anything but opposition research on the part of the Hillary campaign and thus was a made up vehicle to discredit a political opponent. So in short a made up document was used to obtain a FISA court order to spy on Trump in order to win a election. Tell me, how much more third world banana republic do you want us to turn into?
I've seen the "essential" part disputed, but that may not have pierced your bubble. "Essential" is basically an opinion, but whether or not it truly was essential, the use of that word shows that there was more than just the dossier to support the FISA warrant application. And the renewals require the previous warrants to have collected useful intel to justify their renewal, otherwise there's no reason to require renewal. Just as you wanted everyone to not pass judgement until we've seen this memo, you should not pass judgement based solely on the memo, because it isn't a full set of facts and it was put out by someone with a track record of misleading.

But really, if you want to cry Banana Republic, try to step back and look at what Trump is doing. I know you think he aligns pretty closely with what you want. He's tapped into you, harnessing your utter disdain for those that have a difference of opinion. But I'd like to caution you to hold onto whatever principles you have (even if I might disagree with them) and not get lost in his cult of personality. Because he showers his utter disdain on those people and institutions based on whim or on those that don't show fealty. And that's plain dangerous to the republic. Bigly.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by woodchip » Sat Feb 03, 2018 5:27 pm

callmeslick wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:16 pm
what, Woody, did you make that goofy declaration in the first 30 seconds it was released? As the day wore on, the 'memo' was exposed as 1)shoddy, 2) painting a completely false view of available information, 3) likely the handiwork of the White House staff(no member of House committee admitted to any knowledge of the preparation). John McCain flat out declared it to be doing Putin's work. On and on, it has been steadily exposed as an act of Sedition if not outright Treason.
So where are your sources that the memo was exposed? I the actual memo instead of relying on "opinion" pieces like you seem to be doing.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Tunnelcat » Sun Feb 04, 2018 3:39 pm

woodchip wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 5:27 pm
So where are your sources that the memo was exposed? I the actual memo instead of relying on "opinion" pieces like you seem to be doing.
In the memo itself in the last paragraph on the last page.

http://washingtonpress.com/2018/02/02/s ... p-charade/

Never mind that FBI agent Strzok sent disparaging texts about Trump. He was removed from the investigation for doing so, as was proper. Aside from that detail, George Papadopoulos was the FIRST to plead guilty to lying to the FBI and is now is now a cooperating witness. He was also the FIRST to put the FBI onto Russia's election meddling, all because of a drunken bar conversation with an Aussie diplomat. This was BEFORE that Dossier was even on the FBI's radar.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/30/us/p ... oulos.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/30/us/p ... trump.html

Also, don't forget that the Steele Dossier was FIRST compiled and paid for by a Republican and that large sections of that Dossier have already been factually corroborated.

http://www.businessinsider.com/carter-p ... er-2017-11

Then there's that doofus Carter Page. He was under FBI surveillance because the Russians were trying to make him their spy for 3 years, starting in 2013, long before he joined up with Trump. The Dossier didn't even exist then. The man stinks to high heaven. No wonder the FBI had HIM on their radar.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics ... arter-page

https://www.thestar.com/business/2016/0 ... iness.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/04/us/p ... ussia.html
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by callmeslick » Mon Feb 05, 2018 3:35 pm

now, Twitler rants about the 'treasonous' Dems for not cheering his speech enough. You know, the one where he took full credit for the Stock Markets? There is a special place in the irony hall of fame for a proveable traitor calling people 'treasonous' for not cheering for his lies.
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Re: Call your congressmen...

Post by Tunnelcat » Mon Feb 05, 2018 5:16 pm

Whine, whine, whine. We're such victims. Republicans have NOTHING to stand on because they did the same thing to Obama. A little turn about fair play this time. :wink:

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/state-of-the ... eird#49935

I also see the market took care of Trump's economy bragging today for once too. :P
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