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 Post subject: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 10:41 pm 
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Website: http://www.descent2.com/sickone
Location: Antelope Valley, Ca.
So thanks to the help here I have D3 as well as d1 and d2 rebirth running on my new system.
(Asus P6X58D, I7 920@4GHz, 6BGB ram, Geforce 285 GTX 1GB, and a nice 27\" screen, windows 7) back in the day I ran
Voodoo cards be there were the Sh!t for Descent. I also know that many people ran the Nivida cards in D3D or glide and got great frame rates.

Though it is certainly playable, I am more than curious why with the machine listed above I get like 58 - 62fps, and at time see as low as 18.

Yes I have the -framecap 999, VSYNC off etc...
What am I missing ?


Also, I find that everytime I start D3 I have to set it to 32 bit color, and it always falls back to 16 bit (annoying) ???

Any clues for this clueless old fart would be greatly appreciated.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 1:15 am 
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32 bit color is not working, bug in D3. As for the other stuff, set D3 to OpenGL and add a profile in the Nvidia control panel for main.exe w/ the following settings:

Image

For the record, my current command line is:

Code:
-launched -nointro -nooutragelogo -nosparkles -nomotionblur -playermessages -z32bit -framecap 999 -directinput -deadzone0 0.0 -deadzone1 0.0 -nocompress -width 1600 -height 1200 -aspect 1.33 -pilot Grendel


-launched is only needed if you start main.exe directly (eg. via kquery).

Command line for a time test:

Code:
C:\\Games\\Descent3\\MAIN.EXE -launched -nointro -nooutragelogo -nosparkles -nomotionblur -width 1600 -height 1200 -aspect 1.33 -z32bit -framecap 0 -deadzone0 0.0 -deadzone1 0.0 -nocompress -nosound -nonetwork -timetest secret2.dem


My current fps.txt w/ a GTX280, driver 197.13 is:

Code:
861.96 Descent3 v1.4
696 Min
1163 Max
1163 Second 1
696 Second 2
854 Second 3


:)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 9:14 am 
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Website: http://www.descent2.com/sickone
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Thank you sir, I'll give it a try in a while.
I figured I should be seeing insane framerates.

Thanks again.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 9:30 am 
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Isn't it limited by the monitor as well? He has a large screen so it's likely LCD which can't push higher FPS in D3, right?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 11:10 am 
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Yes the 27\" (16:9)is LCD - so is refresh limited, I also haver a 20\" (4:3) CRT which can run very high refersh rates.

In either case, the game plays better if the FPS outruns the refresh.

I am still trying to decide if the LCD is acceptable for game play. It certainly is nice for size - you can see everything! (I am old and blind). I always went for the high refresh in years past - but back then LCDs had a response/persistance that was just sad. This thing has a 2msGTG and I think 3ms On to Off. I just got that display yesterday, and after playing for maybe 15 minutes it seemed fine. As if my eyes had to adjust. I'll keep you informed.

By the way, one of the current wizards should be able to tell how to make the \"Register\" screen disapear ?? I know you do something to the files in the ereg directory.. but what ?

By the way, Ryujin thanks for the ass kicken last night :) I only had a few minutes in Indika with you there but you were tagging me 2:1... made me cry :)


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 11:38 am 
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Sickone wrote:
I know you do something to the files in the ereg directory.. but what ?

delete it :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 7:42 pm 
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I will be installing D3 tonight on my new Windows7 x64 machine, I think I will keep track of the steps to a complete install, then the updated -switch config for my ATI HD5870. It has been a while since I delved into the Catalyst Control Panel not to mention this is the 10.3 with the extra \"Eyefinity\" panels. Nvidia (win7x64) I can do in my sleep... will post later and maybe create a thread that can be sticked with the rundown for both with Fixed-Aspect-Ratio and Full Widescreen options

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 8:02 pm 
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Forgot to mention that I'm running it on a 24\" 16:10 TFT @ 60Hz refresh. In the control panel I set \"Use Nvidia scaling w/ fixed-aspect-ratio\" under Adjust Desktop Size and Position. That way I'll get a 4:3 picture w/ black bars left & right on the 16:10 screen. Changing the command switches to: -width 1920 -height 1200 -aspect 1.6 would result in a widescreen picture, unfortunately changing the aspect ratio in D3 will result in a smaller FOV. Hence my sticking w/ 4:3.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 8:40 pm 
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Not really a smaller FOV.. still 72 degrees left to right, it's just cropped on the top and bottom which is only noticable if you use the cockpit mode. But for some video cards the widescreen has a huge impact on framerates(laptops especially). Now on my 5:4 aspect lcd I did lose horizontal view... but to me that was a mute point. It's all personal preference (except for harware reasons) and your initial setting will probally dictate your future choice. going from a crt to widescreen you will probally choose the fixed ratio because It is what you are accustomed to

this new machine has a 22\" 16:10 WS in which I will try 1680x1050 and then I will set it for 1400x1050 with fixed-aspect..... I will see which one I like better

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 9:50 pm 
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I am actualy running d3 in 16:9 (-aspect 1.78 ) and I seem to like it. After getting the framerates squared away (which was really just telling nvidia to let go of Vsync) I prefer the D3D in 32bit, and the LCD Refresh seems fine. I am glad I went for the 27\" it's really nice.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 9:55 am 
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Well I have to say...that was the easiest install ever of Descent3 on Windows 7 Professional x64

Install D3, Run Once...Exit (Note 1)
Install Mercenary, Run Once... Exit
Install D3 1.4_NoCD_Update from Descent3.com
(Note 2)

Note 1 - Before you launch Descent 3 for the first time in Windows 7.
Right click and select properties of Main.exe
Click the Compatibility Tab
Click \"change settings for all users\"
Tic the option box for:
~\"Disable visual themes\" (disables theme opacity for the application)
~\"Disable desktop composition\"(switches display to windows 7 basic theme while application is running only)
Click Apply and Close


So if you have had the pleasure of pulling your hair out for a day or 2 why Descent3 Launcher hangs and Main.exe minimizes and your back to the desktop on launch.... 2 tics and done

**** Windows XP Compatibility Mode is NOT Required!!!

Note 2 - After Installing D3 1.4 Update -subpixelcorrect switch does not clear the Tick Tac Toe Boards corrupting the D3 Menus(this switch is not required either)

ATI Custom Profile - open your ATI Catalyst Control Center(CCC), select Options from the menu on the upper right, Choose Profile Manager, Create a new profile Type in\"Default\" and click save (so you have your original settings) now create another profile named \"OpenGL\" or \"Descent3\" and click save and activate. this is the one we will edit, go into 3D settings from the menu on the main panel, Select \"All\" Tab, scroll down and change \"Catalyst A.I.\" slider from Advanced to off. Go back to Profile Manager in the Options menu on the right \"Descent3\" profile should still be active if not just select it, click \"Save\" and click yes to overwrite prompt (to keep your selections you modified in the 3D Panel) then click Activate and Close (to reload the profile)

nVidia Program Override - open your nVidia Control Panel(NCP), First click \"Adjust Image Setting with Preview\" from the tree menu on the left. Change the Radio Button to \"Use the advanced 3D image settings\" and click the link \"take me there\" to the right of it. This will take you to the \"Manage 3D Settings\", click on the Program Settings Tab now displayed in the main window. Click the \"ADD\" button and browse out to your descent3 folder and select Main.exe, now the exe will be listed in the program override list.. highlight it in that list it's properties will be displayed in the scroll list below the main one. Scroll to the bottom of the list and change \"Vertical Sync\" to Force Off


These are basic Settings to uncap fps and run - tweeks come later

Profiles can be activated by right clicking the ATI Applet in system~tray and select your profile or it can be bound to a program shortcut.

nVidia's are bound directly to the Exe

Fill in the rest later (for the Lifetime nVidia No0bz - AceCombat :P )

-------------------------------------------------

More Fun Game Icons that do the Dirty work ....muhahahaha

Descent 3 WideScreen Launch Icon:(with every feature turned on Anti-Aliasing 8X(box), Anisotropic 16X, Mimap High,Vsync off, AA Mode:Supersample on high and OpenGL triple Buffering)
Default Screen resolution 1680x1050

(\"C:\\Program Files (x86)\\ATI Technologies\\ATI.ACE\\Core-Static\\CLI.exe\" Start Load profilename=\"Descent3\")


D3 Fixed-Aspect Launch Icon : (all features on again)
Automatically changes my screen resolution to 1400x1050 and forces Fixed aspect ratio via GPU

(\"C:\\Program Files (x86)\\ATI Technologies\\ATI.ACE\\Core-Static\\CLI.exe\" Start Load profilename=\"D3 Fixed-Aspect\")

This saves me the trouble of manually changing resolution, then enabling FAR and finally loading the descent 3 video card custom profile like i have to do with nVidia between games


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 1:18 pm 
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okay so thats for you ATi noobs, what about the NVidia GODS! :twisted: 8) :lol: :wink:


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 3:07 pm 
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AceCombat wrote:
okay so thats for you ATi noobs, what about the NVidia DOGS! :twisted: 8) :lol: :wink:
After all these years being beaten with the nVidia stick it's routine to override the Global Settings on a Geforce to make games run

Eyefinity is New :)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 6:24 pm 
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NVidia dogs, i like it!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 9:11 pm 
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So do I, hence the ninja edit :P

I did have fun configuring my sticks for the first time. I have not loaded a profile in the CH Control Manager until I loaded D3. In so much when a profile is loaded for the first time Windows Vista/7 see the device as a whole new Piece of hardware and gives a temporary ID which will not be resolved until the O/S has it's first reboot.

Even though I had a custom controller D3.ctl file for the Pro Throttle with a setting \"axis=-X-Y+Z-R-U-V\" only one axis would register for both the USB 3DPro and \"CH Control Manager Device 1\" and that was J2 : X Axis. just took a single reboot to align the new joystick list and the 3DPro showed XYR ( Z is axis=-Z in its D3 .ctl) and my throttles mapped mode J2:Z Axis and all is good. This is something I have been aware of as a Beta tester for the CH Manager being used on Vista/7. if you only ever use 1 joystick it's nothing to worry about



Ch Joysticks in Direct Input and Mapped Mode are Logically seen 2 separate Joystick ID's by the operating system

Example
\"CH Pro Throttle USB\" becomes \"CH Control Manager Device 1\"
So to be safe I have 2 separate .ctl files
CHPT.ctl and CHDevice1.ctl so the Axis restriction are in place whether the joystick is mapped or not. D3 has an issue if an XYZ axis joystick in connected and no raw data is received from 1 or 2 of the axis I'm not using

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2010 8:21 am 
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Thx for the D3 Win7 notes Bubba, I'll give that a try!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu May 27, 2010 12:30 pm 
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Hm, on my test box w/ W7U64 the launcher setup won't see any rendering device. Any ideas why that would be ?

Edit: ah, probably because I was running it on a remote desktop. Will verify that tonight :)

Edit2: Yep, that was the problem.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 9:56 pm 
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I know this a little late, but glad you guys have been keeping D3 alive and running smooth on new systems and hardware. I just upgraded some of mine and was pulling my hair out over video issues. Boy was I glad to find this thread.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 11:48 pm 
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Hey! you're welcome. Glad to be of service (on behalf of the DBB ;))


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 11:09 am 
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So after a few years and a move which buried my 3dpro usb converter until a few days ago, Ive finally gotten to installing the descent series again and seeing what happens.

D3 seems to work pretty decently under vista. Ive got two issues that keep popping up however.

1. The render depth slider keeps resetting to 40, which really annoys me to no end in an outdoor area and

2. I cant start mercenaries, it keeps erroring out at the first briefing \"Unable to load level file merc1.d3l\"

Any fixes for these? My video card is an ATI HD4850 with the latest drivers, if that makes a difference.

Another complaint I have is that running it in openGL mode screws up the window size of everything on my desktop when I start D3, while Direct3D doesnt, but since Direct3d looks like boiled ass (choppy as hell), I just close everything first.

And off topic (but still descent related), anyone know of a way to fix a bug in dxx-rebirth that links the music volume to the sfx volume?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 4:42 pm 
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This thread helps much with resolution but field of view. FOV didn't increase after reinstalling the game.

I'm okay with black bars in left and right that I don't want to stretch HUDs.

Ugh. I got black screen with yellow strips when quit a mission.


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 3:17 pm 
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okay ive done everything you guys said...... but im having some problems with my Quad i5 GTX 460 setup.


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 4:37 pm 
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My video card died in my Old P4 system so I'm buying a new system tomorrow. I7-950 etc etc. Might only have 6 gigs RAM but it's actually mroe than i can afford right now. Can't wait to try some new and old games on this system. I was running AGp video so it tells you how old it is. Currently I've been playing;

Test drive unlimited
UT 2004
UT3
D2x rebirth
Race On
Half life 2
Portal

Waiting for Diablo 3 and portal 2 but after spending just ovedr 1000 for my new system, new games will have to wait.

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Game Stock Car 2012, Diablo 3, Descent 3 1.5 Patch, C&C Generals, Independance War 2, Starfleet Command 2, Settlers IV,Tzar, Allegiance, Starfleet Command, MAX 2, Defiance
ASUS Z170-P, Core I7-6700K, Coolermaster Hyper 212 EVO CPU Cooler, Gigabyte GF GTX970 OC 4GB GDDR5,Crucial 16GB 2133MHz DDR4, Samsung 850 EVO 250GB 2.5" SATA3 SSD, WD Black 1 TB, ASUS DVD Burner, ASUS 27" Monitor, Fractal Design R5 Mid-Tower Case, Thermaltake ToughPower Gold 750 Watt, Win 10 64Bit


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 5:11 pm 
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i just built a i5 Machine and im thinking to push to a i7 machine on the 1156 socket. just for the HT benefit. i run 8GB and 2 500GB drives on a GTX 460 1GB


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:53 am 
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What kind of problems are you having?


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 4:36 pm 
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im guessing the game itself is having problems...... because when i try to exit a game, the menu is a black screen with yellow textures


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 4:40 pm 
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Sounds like you have it set to use Direct3D (D3 is pretty buggy in D3D). I'd suggest trying OpenGL.

[Note that there is a known bug in D3's OpenGL implementation under NVidia, which causes the game to go to a black screen after a game. Alt-Tabbing in and out fixes it pretty quickly.]


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 4:47 pm 
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AceCombat wrote:
im guessing the game itself is having problems...... because when i try to exit a game, the menu is a black screen with yellow textures

I had the exact problem, I solved it by setting up in NVIDIA control panel. I follow Grendel's post.

Or 1.5 beta patch fixed it.

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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 4:48 pm 
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Glowhyena wrote:
Or 1.5 patch fixed it.


Only use the 1.5 patch if you do not want to play multiplayer games.


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 4:52 pm 
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Foil wrote:
Only use the 1.5 beta patch if you do not want to play multiplayer games.

Ahh, hah. I'm waiting they release full 1.5 patch.

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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 12:59 pm 
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Location: Camping the energy center. BTW, did you know you can have up to 100 characters in this location box?
Today I was working on one of my older systems so I could give it away to one of the guys in III that needs a PC to play D3 on and while I was at it I decided to check and see how it ran on my latest system just for the hell of it:
i7-2700k, 8 GB RAM, Geforce 460 1 GB, Windows 7 x64, 1600x1200:
Code:
1028.25 Descent3 v1.4
2 Min
1770 Max
1770 Second 1
1293 Second 2
I have never seen so much screen tearing before in my life, there were probably upwards of 100 different torn frames on the screen (60 Hz refresh LCD) at each refresh. :P


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:42 pm 
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I'm having issues getting my Descent 3 to display at the proper resolution on my Vista 64 bit machine.

Here's the command line I'm using:
-height 1920 -width 1080 -framecap 999 -bumped -aspect 1.78 -nointro -nooutragelogo -z32bit -pilot Jazriel

It displays at what I think is 800*600 for the main menu and everything else. My laptop has an Nvidia 9600GM, not sure if I should try adjusting options through my video card drivers or what.


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 8:25 am 
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In Descent 3 the menu screens and automap are hard coded to 640x480. Custom resolutions don't kick in till you're in the actual game.


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 10:00 am 
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What did the 1.5 patch correct? Wasn't 32bit color fixed in there?


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 6:49 pm 
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32 bit color still doesn't work in OpenGL render in the 1.5 betas, however it has always worked in even in 1.4 if you use the Direct3D render (but unfortunately the game cannot save 32 bit screenshots, so they get sampled down via nearest neighbor to 16 bit). The performance advantage OpenGL has over Direct3D is pretty much irrelevant; nobody is going to care about a 15-20% difference when the minimum FPS is still 500+. The only difference between 1.4 and 1.5 that relates to 32 bit color is the game now remembers the last setting (1.4 always reset to 16 bit on restart).

Other things that are fixed in 1.5 are a couple methods of multiplayer cheating (table file edits), the linux checksum bug was worked on, but without the linux ports included that goes nowhere and other bugs or glitches of varying severity (for instance, load single player v1.4, select chaff in your countermeasures then use it while standing still, reverse till you can see the chaff, select fusion as your primary and shoot the chaff with it: the game will crash to the desktop).


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 4:48 pm 
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Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2003 2:01 am
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just for shits and giggles, im once again trying D3 on my Win7 Pro x64 on a 3770K and Nvidia 570HD


i STILL cannot get this shit to run right!! for some reason even IN the game it runs me @ 640x480x16@60

ive tried playing with EVERY option on D3, D3 Setup and the NCP, it will not leave the 640x480


maybe one of you guru's can teamview me and fix my stuff? :mrgreen: :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:01 pm 
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In game menus / the automap / etc (main.exe) always run at 640x480. It doesn't kick over to the resolution specified by either the resolution settings in-game or the -width -height command line options till you are at the point where you can actually shoot lasers. And should the OS throw that the selected resolution is unsupported (say trying 1600x1200 on a 1680x1050 monitor), it'll kick/default back to 640x480. So you need to set D3 to run at a resolution and refresh rate that is supported by your monitor and video driver or it will always default to 640x480.


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 9:17 am 
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It may also be a UAC issue. I vaguely recall having to set Win7 admin permissions on something in D3 before the command-line stuff would get applied.


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2012 6:48 pm 
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UAC is COMPLETELY disabled on my machine


Krom i have it set for 1920x1080 @ 60

and i know about the menus and stuff being always 640x480, but even when i get in the game, it will not run @ -width 1920 -height 1080


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 Post subject: Re: Descent 3 on newer machines ??
PostPosted: Sat Oct 20, 2012 6:27 pm 
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Location: Camping the energy center. BTW, did you know you can have up to 100 characters in this location box?
Did you try it with both OpenGL and Direct3D?


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