Comic critics come! -help a friend out for me please

Isaac · Post by **Isaac** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 3:43 am

Friend's new anime comic \"Kohad\". A work in progress. Thanks for helping!

Kilarin · Post by **Kilarin** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 8:32 am

There is no option for \"too gross\".

Sorry, just not my style of story. I couldn't make it past the first 10 pages. Hopefully someone who likes the gore will be able to give a better critique.

TIGERassault · Post by **TIGERassault** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 8:54 am

Well, my opinion?

Rubbish! Not only is the 'story' just an obvious excuse to try and show off his artistic talent, but the fames themselves were barely conceivable for the first 20 or so comics! It really needs to be simpler so that it doesn't take about a minute looking at each frame to understand what it is.

Foil · Post by **Foil** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 9:13 am

I (somehow) managed to get through all forty pages.

Here's my opinion:

- The author is a talented artist, and could probably be quite successful in that field.
- The story... er, lack thereof... was utterly pointless. After all forty pages, what do we know about the girl? Nothing, besides that the artist enjoys drawing her nude and bloody. After all forty pages, what do we know about the \"master\" she keeps calling? Nothing but a name and a vague reference to \"powerful friends\". What do we know about the setting? Again, virtually nothing besides monsters and a landscape. Does this \"nothingness\" pique my interest in future episodes? Absolutely not.
- Frankly, I'm a bit concerned about the author. Violence, blood, and gore in this type of work is one thing; but to have forty solid pages of it for no apparent reason, and the \"master\" character clearly enjoying the blood and pain... makes me think there are some seriously messed-up issues in the author's life.

Isaac · Post by **Isaac** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 11:47 am

good work you guys! thanks! I would love it if a few more could vote!!! I wish i could pay you guys for helping. Thanks!

Spooky · Post by **Spooky** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 1:44 pm

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 1:58 pm

Someone has some pretty sick imagination. If that reflects what's currently on the market, ugh..

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 2:12 pm

That was plain messed up, there was no story to follow, just a bunch of random violence and nudity that made no sense.

This person is a fairly talented artist, but tell them to write a real script, or get someone else to write one for them...

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:49 pm

disturbing on many levels. I had to turn it off.

Diedel · Post by **Diedel** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 5:39 pm

Disgusting and perverted.

Have the author see a psychiatrist, maybe he can help. Or maybe call the police. Who knows what this guy's up to in a year or two.

Spaceboy · Post by **Spaceboy** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 8:48 pm

Wow lol, i actually felt like puking, half the slides were covered in blood and ew.
god damn i hope i never have to look at anything like that again lol

Isaac · Post by **Isaac** » Tue Jan 02, 2007 12:33 am

Thanks a lot you guys!

Firewheel · Post by **Firewheel** » Tue Jan 02, 2007 9:14 am

That was just disturbing. Unfortunately, I clicked the second option; I thought it said \"Did not like.\"

Mobius · Post by **Mobius** » Tue Jan 02, 2007 1:58 pm

Blood != story

Sorry, not interested.

I like \"Breaking things and shooting people(TM)\" - but that's kinda silly.

Isaac · Post by **Isaac** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 1:51 am

Well thanks for you comments... but i got this sarcastic email after i showed him the results. He did think it was a "cool idea" when i said i could do this.

chris wrote: Awesome!!

Their comments are EXACTLY what I was looking for.

I bet most of'em are gonna be "closet" fans.

Thanks man!

Kilarin · Post by **Kilarin** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 7:03 am

I bet most of'em are gonna be \"closet\" fans.

Your friend has a serious disconnect from reality. A SCARY disconnect. I hope he finds his way back home.

Isaac · Post by **Isaac** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 1:09 pm

no... that would be sarcasm

Tyranny · Post by **Tyranny** » Fri Jan 26, 2007 11:05 am

[rant]
GAAAH? Far be it from me to resuscitate a dead thread, but uh...are you all a bunch of girls? (actual girls are excluded from that comment, k thx

).

While I agree with the statements that there was no point to the story, everyone's strong aversion to the violence strikes me as funny. Obviously the artist is going with an anime or..possibly a psuedo hentai theme and in comparision with a lot of animes I've seen, the gore / nudity expression factor was pretty low.

It's also amusing to me that you insult the artist's state of mind accusing him of having some sort of mental problem. The blood isn't even real for starters, hell it's not even tangible and then the nudity...OMG!

Ok children....

It still boggles my mind at how people can go around critiquing art, literature or motion pictures when true atrocities happen on a much larger scale all around us every day. [/rant]

Anywho, Isaac, if you re-read this, let your friend know that if he means to be serious about a web-comic, he needs to come up with more dialog. There absolutely has to be a story, the thing won't survive on visuals alone. Also...might want to design a nice website for it with Last, Previous, Next, Latest buttons and whatnot. Create an archive of previous issues etc...

There was no backstory for what happened, everything just seems random. He may know whats going on, but the hardest part about comic book work is transferring whats in your head on paper so that everyone else knows what is going on too.

Alright...for everyone's enjoyment...

Kilarin · Post by **Kilarin** » Fri Jan 26, 2007 11:26 am

It still boggles my mind at how people can go around critiquing art, literature or motion pictures when true atrocities happen on a much larger scale all around us every day.

Because he ASKED for a critique perhaps?

Testiculese · Post by **Testiculese** » Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:08 pm

I missed this first time around. Good artist, a bit gory, not enough nudity to match the gory (hey sex sells). Also too disconnected, the scenes look like slideshow images too many seconds apart. Lastly, no plot to speak of..whether that's by design and introduced later or just not thought about is up to him.

TIGERassault · Post by **TIGERassault** » Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:12 pm

Tyranny wrote:It still boggles my mind at how people can go around critiquing art, literature or motion pictures when true atrocities happen on a much larger scale all around us every day.

I don't know where the hell you live, but here in Ireland, people do not get eaten alive in a very gory manner every day!

And why does it not suprise me that this has a lot less nudity than the animations you watch...

Top Wop · Post by **Top Wop** » Fri Jan 26, 2007 8:20 pm

This is just idiotic. Im surprised this hasn't been moved to the NHB forum yet.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Sat Jan 27, 2007 1:28 am

Tyranny wrote:[rant]
GAAAH? Far be it from me to resuscitate a dead thread, but uh...are you all a bunch of girls? (actual girls are excluded from that comment, k thx ).

pfft. I've seen a lot of gore in my day. ogrish, stileproject, ghost in the shell... the comic was just too much gore thrown in too soon.

meh.

Tyranny · Post by **Tyranny** » Sat Jan 27, 2007 4:34 pm

Kilarin wrote:Because he ASKED for a critique perhaps?

Yes he did...

Tyranny wrote:Anywho, Isaac, if you re-read this, let your friend know that if he means to be serious about a web-comic, he needs to come up with more dialog. There absolutely has to be a story, the thing won't survive on visuals alone. Also...might want to design a nice website for it with Last, Previous, Next, Latest buttons and whatnot. Create an archive of previous issues etc...

There was no backstory for what happened, everything just seems random. He may know whats going on, but the hardest part about comic book work is transferring whats in your head on paper so that everyone else knows what is going on too.

or...

Testiculese wrote:I missed this first time around. Good artist, a bit gory, not enough nudity to match the gory (hey sex sells). Also too disconnected, the scenes look like slideshow images too many seconds apart. Lastly, no plot to speak of..whether that's by design and introduced later or just not thought about is up to him.

These are examples of an objective critique...a critique is not insulting or questioning the mental state of the artist. It's an open minded observation of what the artist needs to do to make the strip better without calling into question his sanity.

Tigerassault: I live in the US to which I'm sure now you'll believe that answers all your questions. I do not regularly watch or view things with nudity. All that was meant by my statement was the fact that nudity is natural, but yet people still get shocked or upset when they see it in art or other mediums. As an artist myself, theres something about that which I'll never understand.

Isaac · Post by **Isaac** » Sun Jan 28, 2007 1:21 pm

Tyranny thanks! i'll tell him soon!

Bet51987 · Post by **Bet51987** » Sun Jan 28, 2007 6:59 pm

Ok, I went and looked at it. YUK..... but I didn't find it offensive in any way and didn't see anything that should send it to the NHB. I've seen a lot of Blood horror movies with my friends, because they like to see me shake, that were much worse than this cartoon.

I don't know much about this kind of work, but I was left with the impression that the artist is very talented and the \"distinctive style\" of his drawings doesn't mean he has mental issues. To say that would put M. Night Shyamalan on top of the list.

I'm not sure what is the accepted norm for this kind of work, but I found it boring. If I were forced at gunpoint to do this for a friend, I would make it a self running slide show with each segment staying for about 5 seconds before a fade out-fade in would bring up the next slide. I would also have \"dark\" music playing in the background timed to volume up on certain slides with changeable lighting. The silence killed me.

Just my two cents and good luck to you....

Bettina

Lobber · Post by **Lobber** » Sun Jan 28, 2007 8:47 pm

Its way too slow.

Tell your friend he can tell the story in about one fifth as many pages, just make it brief, to the point.

Less is more.

All that could have been expressed in 8 pages or less.

Also, it wasn't clear what the direction of movement was for Reenah in alot of the scenes. In fact, it almost seemed incongruous because it appeared she was mortally wounded, then became whole again, albeit nude and bloody, without any explanation.

The story isn't believable, it's too hard to follow, and it takes way way too long to even get to the point.

Shorten it up and cut out about 80% of the pages and frames and make it make sense in a shorter amount of time.

Notice, I don't comment about the content of the story, because that's his artistic liscense. But he needs to tell the story faster, in a quicker pace.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Sun Jan 28, 2007 9:22 pm

If you want some rough guidelines on how to make a comic like this, take a look at some anime/manga movies. note how the dialogue flows with the action specifically.

Isaac · Post by **Isaac** » Sun Jan 28, 2007 11:56 pm

Thanks you guys! I'll make sure he reads ur posts (the guy checks his email almost once a week... i'm going to call him)

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Mon Jan 29, 2007 12:14 am

technically, this is an attempt at manga. Anime is moving manga.
Sorry Tyr. Tripe is tripe. This guy may be decent artist, but he is Not a story teller. Art is not an excuse for whatever people wants to let spill out of their heads.

Isaac · Post by **Isaac** » Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:05 am

Duper wrote: Art is not....

WRONG!! it is. It's anything and everything, known and unkown. The only thing you can define about it, is your taste.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Mon Jan 29, 2007 3:43 am

Duper wrote:Art is not an excuse for whatever people wants to let spill out of their heads.

If that were the case, we wouldn't see half the art we do. There'd be no Picasso, no andy wharhol, no Edvard Munch

Kilarin · Post by **Kilarin** » Mon Jan 29, 2007 7:20 am

Duper wrote:Art is not....

Isaac wrote:WRONG!! it is...

Both.
If we define art as something produced creatively, then sure, just about anything qualifies.

But if we use the dictionaries first definition:
the quality, production, expression, or realm, according to aesthetic principles, of what is beautiful, appealing, or of more than ordinary significance.
Then there will definitely be creative works that do not qualify as "beautiful, appealing, or of more than ordinary significance".

Of course, now we run into the problem of absolutes. Because who judges what is beautiful?

From this point, we are going to find a wide divide in opinion. One side will say that beauty is absolute, regardless of whether we recognize it or not. The other side says that all beauty and significance is in the eye of the beholder and there is no standard to measure against.

I fall between the two camps, but much closer to the absolutest side. I believe that there really are absolutes, and that some things really DO have beauty and significance whether anybody recognizes it or not, and vice versa. But I also acknowledge that individual taste and opinion comes into this issue.

Foil · Post by **Foil** » Mon Jan 29, 2007 10:45 am

I should also have clarified my (second) point earlier:

I wasn't objecting to the blood, violence and nudity because of what it is, I was objecting to the way it was used. Specifically, it seemed to be there just for it's shock value alone.

At least to my (admittedly-Western) sense of fiction, it had no story behind it. Unlike the anime scene in \"Kill Bill vol. 1\" which involved a known character and had an established storyline, there was no clear reason for the level of blood/violence here.

I will, however, echo the sentiment that the author shows some skill. If he can work on his story-telling, it would vastly improve his work.

TIGERassault · Post by **TIGERassault** » Mon Jan 29, 2007 12:01 pm

Foil wrote:I wasn't objecting to the blood, violence and nudity because of what it is, I was objecting to the way it was used. Specifically, it seemed to be there just for it's shock value alone.

X2

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Mon Jan 29, 2007 12:45 pm

Ferno wrote:
Duper wrote:Art is not an excuse for whatever people wants to let spill out of their heads.
If that were the case, we wouldn't see half the art we do. There'd be no Picasso, no andy wharhol, no Edvard Munch

I ever said they were right either.

JMEaT · Post by **JMEaT** » Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:52 pm

I think if your friend is trying to belong to the Manga genre he should maybe have some dialog to back up his violence. I understand the blood/gore/nudity etc, it sets a quite alien and out of control environment/mood, however there needs to be more dialog.

It held my interest for a bit but as the same stuff was repeated with no apparent explanation it got too long winded and boring.

My 2 cents.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Mon Jan 29, 2007 2:56 pm

Duper wrote:I ever said they were right either.

ever?

Just kiddin, dude.

Isaac · Post by **Isaac** » Mon Jan 29, 2007 3:00 pm

Ferno wrote:
Duper wrote:I ever said they were right either.
ever?

Just kiddin, dude.

I think the engrish translation is "i always said they were right"

Tyranny · Post by **Tyranny** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 12:01 pm

Duper wrote:technically, this is an attempt at manga. Anime is moving manga.
Sorry Tyr. Tripe is tripe. This guy may be decent artist, but he is Not a story teller. Art is not an excuse for whatever people wants to let spill out of their heads.

He hasn't really presented a story for him to be ruled out as a good story teller. I'll agree that it's tripe now, but it's a matter of helping him make it better tripe

Thx, btw, on the manga correction. Was in a hurry to type everything and anime was the first thing that jumped into my head.

Comic critics come! -help a friend out for me please

How do you feel about this comic/story, by Christopher Rodriguez?

Comic critics come! -help a friend out for me please

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